SE: I would say that there is a bigger following of this movie now than there ever was!
CM: That is so nice to hear.  Maybe people would assume that it gets back to me, but unless someone tells me… I don’t know.

SE: I first saw it during it’s first run at a drive-in when I was a kid. It just blew me away!
CM: There’s a lady friend of mine that lives down the road.  She was a playmate in the 50’s and  she says, “Every time I’m with you, somebody will come up and say”…”What is it?” And I say…”It’s something you can’t explain.” So I gave her a copy and she said, “What is it?” I said….” You’ve just got to go with the flow.”  And she really didn’t enjoy it until she watched it a second time. I said “Yeah, don’t try and figure it out. Just go with it”!

SE: I know that whenever I show it to anybody they end up leaving saying “I’ll never forget that movie!”
CM: Yeah, it’s Russ Meyer having a field day!

SE: Folks still get it confused with “Valley of the Dolls”.
CM: Yes!

SE: If I’m asked, ” What’s the movie about?” I just say it’s like Josie & the Pussycats meet the Manson family.
CM: Yes! [Laughs]

SE: I mentioned to your manager that I remember seeing a scene in the movie back in 1970 that was not included in the video release of the film. When you guy’s got to L.A. and stop at a motel for the night, it was you and Pet in one bed, and Kelly and Harris in the other making out while you tried to sleep.
CM: She mentioned that to me twice, and after I hung up the phone I said, “HOLY COW!”  That’s the shot that they used in the playboy layout. And I think I remember doing that scene, but there was so much footage taken and with the footage that wasn’t used, you could make another picture!

SE: Really!
CM: Yes, I remember shooting a lot of things, and then I’d think… what happened to that scene? Then I’ll hear… “Did you see it on laser disc? They have another trailer added” and I thought… oh well, maybe they used those out takes. So it’s a little confusing to me as to what Russ kept in his closet to pull out for teasers for up coming attraction type things. I don’t know, but I do know that he’s a bit of a hoarder, sort of like a pack rat.

SE: Awhile back I spoke to Russ Meyer, and he couldn’t remember any such scene. Have you spoken with Russ lately?
CM: Well, I got an email not too long ago saying that he’s not doing so well. He has his days like everybody his age where they have their good days and bad days. They told me that he really has a problem with his memory. I recently went to the tribute.. to the Russ Meyer film extravaganza at the Egyptian theater here.  I called him… I was coming back from a show in Atlanta, and it was a week long program, and what I had heard from his secretary was that he’d been down there for every showing. And “Beyond the Valley of the Dolls” was to show twice and I couldn’t make the first showing. I heard that Mike Meyers had come because he’s just a true fan.  He just sat in the audience. He didn’t go there to be Mike Meyers, he went as a fan. I told them that I could come to the last showing. Well, the showing was at ten o clock at night.  It was a full house.  Russ was just doing great, his spirits were high, and he and Mr. Moran were there, the guy that does all the film narration that Russ has in all his films.

SE: Oh yes.
CM: So we took questions from the audience which is always a lot of fun, and Russ seemed a little confused.  I had been told about his condition, so I wasn’t shocked. But, someone asked him a question pertaining to one of the scenes and… Russ landed in Normandy on D-DAY and that would be an experience for anyone… And he kind of referred back to D-DAY.

SE: Really.
CM: Yes, he had a lot of soldiers die in his arms, so I answered the question for him, and then someone mentioned his beloved Eve, who was killed in the Canary islands, and I could see that saddened him for a second, and he said that she was a wonderful woman… I don’t think that he ever really got over Eve. But the film festival was a huge hit! There were people there that were die hard fans.  I was just so happy that I was able to get in for the last showing.

SE: Do you make it to many of its showings?
CM: Well, the most fun one was one that Russ and Haji and myself went to. Harvard had a Russ Meyer film festival, and that was a huge presentation. It was so much fun to be at a university of that stature and have so many film students… it was overwhelming the reception that we received, because when you walk into something like this, you don’t know… and there was a panel of women’s liberationists, and these women looked like they could double for G.I. Joe, they were so militant, and I thought… I’m not going to try to make any profound statements, or defend womanhood, or Russ Meyer or anything like that. Just swing with it.

And they were prepared to do battle, so I said, ” It was a lot of fun, and if that’s being exploited? Exploit me some more! It was just a lot of fun and the movie is something that I’ll have memories to treasure. It was a great experience”  and, you know… “Next question!”  Because they really wanted to tear me apart!.. [Laughs]…for being in a Russ Meyer film and we were having so much fun that I thought… don’t put a towel on the fire!

SE: It was thirty years ago, jeez!
CM: I know

SE: The movie is his best I have to say. It keeps my interest through the whole movie.
CM: Well, I wouldn’t have done the film if Twentieth Century Fox hadn’t been involved because I had seen “Vixen” and I thought, ” WOW! I can see why it’s making such a stir.”  I saw it in an art house when I was still in high school in Ohio, so, lo and behold, when I came out here and I was in acting class… I had an agent, and they said that Russ Meyer’s been trying to get a hold of you! And I thought, “Oh my gosh! Russ Meyer, oh that wild man!”  [Laughs] You know? The man that your mother warns you about! So they said. ”Wait! He’s got an office and a contract with Twentieth Century Fox, and I thought…”Well, if it’s Twentieth Century Fox, a major studio, this must be legitimate and his antics have to be toned down a bit.”

SE: Not much.
CM: I know.. [laughing] The thing that frightened me with “Vixen” was that it was the obvious, let’s do everything that’s taboo, let’s hint at incest, and racial barriers, break them down! I think she made love with everybody except a priest. And I thought,  “Oh my gosh!”  That’s what frightened me about that film and I thought I would never do anything like that.

SE: You were curious about that movie while in high school?
CM: Yes, I was very curious, but I loved films like “Swept away” by Lena Wertmuller, her films…  and sometimes you would just have to go to an art theater to be able to see these films. So there was a little art theater in Toledo, Ohio and when the paper would come, I’d say… “I wonder what’s showing?”  I just made it a habit to look at non mainstream films.

SE: So after high school that’s what you wanted to do, get into film?
CM: I think all little girls dream of being a ballerina, or being a model. It’s sort of like a fairy tale.  What little girl wouldn’t want to do something like that? When Playboy found me, I decided to do it.  I was in Chicago for the shoot and Hef came up to me and said… “We’re going to do this Playboy After Dark television show and would you be a part of it? We’d really like to have you as a regular on the show”. And I said, “That sounds like a lot of fun! Of course I’ll do it.”  So I came out here to shoot that, but because so many things happened right in that same time frame… there was the democratic convention of 68” happening, and there were a lot of people at the Playboy mansion while I was there.

SE: You were 18 or 19 at the time?
CM: Yes, I graduated when I was 17.  Burt Lancaster said,  “A friend of mine is shooting a film at Warner Brother’s. Sydney Pollack.  Would you…” and I was taking acting lessons from Jeff Corey, and Bruce Stern.. and Burt said, “Would you like to be part of that film?” And I said that I would love that! That would pay for my apartment, my acting lessons, and the movie was “They Shoot Horses Don’t They”, and that was a long run. It seemed like… my goodness, I worked on that film for 3 months. Even though I didn’t have a major role, or any speaking role, just a small line. It was such a wonderful experience to be on the set everyday with Jane Fonda and Gig Young and Red Buttons, Bruce Stern, and Susannah York. Then I thought… Gig Young won the academy award, he’d been in films his whole life playing the good looking leading man, and he wins an academy award for playing a snake in the grass promoter with low morals, and he goes home and he kills his wife, and then kills himself.  I said…”These people in Hollywood are really insane!”  [Laughs]

SE: Yeah, still are.
CM: Yes they are. Then “Dolls” was such a wonderful roller coaster, it was like somebody said,  “The ride’s not going to end! You get to stay at the park all day! It’s gonna keep going!” This is great!

SE: So how long did it take to shoot “Dolls”?
CM: Oh boy, I think I worked on the film for about two months.

SE: That movie is all about editing…
CM: I think Russ is more famous for being an editor than for being a director.  I think he got clued into the attention span of the American male because of the voluptuous women aspect of his films. He doesn’t want anyone to get bored.

SE: His other movies don’t really grab me, but this one in particular…
CM: Well, his sense of humor…

SE: Yeah. It’s funny!
CM: Right to when he names characters like Porter Hall.  And it goes back to Normandy, and it goes back to Hitler.  I thought…”WOW!”  His mind goes off and weaves an intricate web.

SE: So before this, were you modeling prior to Playboy, or is that where you started?
CM: I went down to Florida for spring break, and I had so many people come up to me and say…” Are you a Playboy playmate?”, “Are you a centerfold?”, and I’d say, “No.”  And they’d say. ”Well you should be!” Then I’d walk a little further down the beach and someone else would say. “Are you in Playboy?”  I had so many people ask me that question that I thought. Well, maybe I should be. [Laughs] I wanted to train for the U.S. quartering team and the horses were … they are so expensive that I thought…”My gosh. If I do this I’ll be able to buy a car, and pay for my horses.”  I couldn’t have done it if they showed below the waist.  I couldn’t have done that, or ever looked at my mother in the eye again. I look at these pictures and I really don’t see me, because I was so nervous, and so scared. In my centerfold, when I look in my eyes I can see how frightened I was. I’ve got this deer in the headlights look… “Gosh, am I doing the right thing? It’s too late to get up and run out of here.”

SE: The one time they had a showing of “Dolls” at the Marin film festival a few years back…Russ was there, but nobody else from the movie was there.
CM: He’d be approached about a film festival, with all these enthusiastic, wonderful fans that we have, and he would grab one girl. And I’d say. “C’mon Russ, take all of us!”  When he was with Edy Williams I would think… well maybe Edy doesn’t want anybody else there; maybe she wants to have all the attention. Stu Phillips, who did the music… he should definitely be there! When I was on stage with Russ, he would get just as many questions about the music. The music was such a big part of the film.

SE: Now, did Russ call you in for an audition?
CM: It seemed to be a little unusual, then the more I thought about it I thought… “Gee, this isn’t unusual.  He just really wants to get all the characters together so that we’re acquainted with one another, and rather than waste studio time, he called us together. He had an apartment in Century City and we would meet there just to break the ice. We’re all set to play these roles… We’re all introduced. He wanted feedback as to how we felt about how this character was…He wanted to make sure that when we went in to do it for real that we were all on the same wavelength as far as how the characters should evolve.

SE: So you read the script before you agreed to do it?
CM: Yes.

SE: So you knew what you were getting into.
CM: Yes.  I was okay with it. Then there was so much talk about the arguing in the studio… the CEO didn’t want it to be an X rating, and they’d say that it was because of the violence.

SE: That’s something I could never figure out, the X-rating, because when I saw it at the drive-in back in 1970, it was playing right alongside a Disney movie or something.
CM: I know.  I have one poster where there was an X, and rather than re-do the whole poster, they took a piece of paper with an r on it and pasted it over the X. So it’s kind of a cute memory of the rating war that was going on. I knew that I was going to have a love scene with Erica.  I’d met Erica.. she’s a darling lady.  I genuinely like her. After we met we knew we both had the same thoughts. That we wanted this to be tender, and pretty, not like… I’m the girl with the buck knife and leather pants coming after you! [Laughs] You know, this is going to be a very tender, erotic, and pretty love scene. I think it was almost unspoken as to how we wanted that love scene to be and then it was like a big weight lifted off of our shoulders because we both viewed it the same way. That was the only thing I was concerned with after reading the script. How that love scene would be portrayed, and the nudity. I knew that because it was Twentieth Century Fox that we weren’t going to be on a Russ Meyer film set being shot out of a cabin in Canada you know, with twenty men and me and that there wouldn’t be all kinds of film rolling of me naked in the wheat grass, or jumping on a Mountie. [laughs] So the nudity part I knew would be protected by the fact that it was a major studio, so those were my two main issues. And the third… my gosh, this was a role for a major motion picture company and I hope I do well!

SE: Now during some scenes, it kind of looks like you’re trying not to laugh, am I right about that?
CM: Are you sure it wasn’t when we‘re… was that the music from Fantasia? When we were all around that hookah and people were getting high?

SE: Yeah, I think so.
CM: I don’t know how Russ got permission to use it… now who wouldn’t laugh if you’re in a scene and they start playing that? All I could think of was Mickey Mouse dancing with a broom. [Laughs]

SE: I think it was the scene outside by the tree.
CM: I have a still… it’s somewhere here where I’m underneath the tree and Russ is crouched over me, and it looks like he’s really yelling at me because he’s so very serious and he has a stern look about him.  Anyway, he’s pointing his finger at me like he’s really giving me the third degree and he really isn’t.  He was giving me his view of how the scene should go. But Erica was very shy, she’d go in and out of shyness.  I remember it might have been at the Paramount ranch… but I remember we had to leave early in the morning to go to this location, and Russ being Russ… he’s notorious for turning in a film on time and under budget! He takes pride in delivering the goods, and he nicknamed me “One Take Annie” because I thought, “He’s doing this scene, and in his mind he’s already shooting the fifth scene after this!”  So I always wanted to be prepared.  And Erica was once in her dressing trailer, and I knew Russ was looking at his watch like… we’ve got to be back to Fox studios.  He wanted to run out there and get this done and be back in the caravan on the way back for afternoon shooting, and it seemed like forever that she didn’t come out of the trailer.. and Russ was pacing, and that means he was nervous, because she wouldn’t come out of the trailer.

SE: That’s weird, because she was in a couple of his movies before that one.
CM: That’s why I couldn’t understand… I said, “This is vixen? This is the girl that initiates all of the love scenes? She’s the promiscuous lady with freedom in her heart? With no inhibitions?”   But I think that she was involved with a lady at the time and that lady was an extra, and there were certain times that I was naive to this and I couldn’t understand why sometimes she was receptive and initiated the scene… because she was supposed to be the initiator and there were certain times that she was very shy. But she had a girlfriend that was working in the film. She was in the party scene and in the dance sequences. And I didn’t realize it until someone said “Oh, there’s Erica’s girlfriend” And I looked.. and it was in Zman’s party scene and there she was crouched down holding onto a railing.. just sort of sitting on her haunches staring at Erica. And I thought, “She shouldn’t do that. She’s making Erica apprehensive. She shouldn’t do this. We’re trying to make a movie here! Why is she giving her the evil eye? Didn’t she read the script? Didn’t Erica tell her? Don’t sabotage the scene please!”  I couldn’t even go there.  I couldn’t worry about Erica and her lady friend.  I just wanted to do the scene in continuity with what we’ve done so far. I didn’t want to jump over and say,  “Erica, now are we going to change in midstream?” Am I supposed to seduce her? Because it wasn’t written that way.

SE: Was this girlfriend on camera?
CM: When Playboy came to do a ten page article on the film there was a buzz around.  Hef came and we all hugged and reminisced and talked because we all knew each other.  Russ had shot his first wife Eve for a centerfold, so none of us were strangers to one another, but when they did the spread and I received a copy, they included a photo of Erica’s girlfriend.

SE: Which one is she?
CM: She’s Asian and she’s got a lot of ribbons and sparkles on her face.  And when I looked at it I said, “That’s the girl that kept throwing daggers at Erica and I.”  I should have had a talk with her before the film and said, “Look, if this is gonna make you feel uncomfortable don’t be on the set!”

SE: Now, in the party scene at Zman’s, you’re wearing the Boy Wonder costume, was that Burt Ward’s from wardrobe?
CM: That really is Burt Ward’s.  I ran into him at an autograph show.  He was signing autographs and he had a color photo of him in the Boy Wonder suit, so he introduced himself and we were chatting and I told him that I wore that costume in a film, and he said,  “I bet you looked a lot better in it than I did!” [Laughs] I said “Well, I have to admit that I did.”  It was altered.  I remember If we’d shoot late… I had a trench coat and I’d put it on over whatever costume that I wore in the last scene.  I’d come home and I’d put the costume over the kitchen chair.  I’d take a shower, read my lines and go to bed for an early call in the morning. I remember walking into the kitchen, and there’s Robin’s costume on my kitchen chair.  I’d say “Oh God, I’ve got to put it back on!” I could be arrested for wearing this, so I’d put my trench coat on.

SE: After ’Dolls”, where did you disappear to?
CM: I put my career on the back burner which is something I wish I’d never done.  I really wish I’d never done that. The old saying that there’s a man behind every bush? I was under contract with the William Morris Agency.  I had a good agent there that wholeheartedly believed in me…  I should’ve stayed and put him on the back burner instead of my career! I was so naive.  Because you see, in this town if you disappear for more than a year…

SE: Your family starts to get condolence cards?
CM: Yes! You’re already buried at Forest Lawn.  So this guy was called to do a western and he said,  “Come along on the interview.”  I said, “Are you sure you don’t want to just go alone?” And he says, “No C’mon.” Well , he didn’t get the role, but I got the female lead. So, then I did a western with Bob Fuller and Nick Crevette, and then I did another western after that with Vera Miles and Sam Elliot. Then I was at Twentieth Century Fox one day and Ron Samuels, I believe his name is… He handled Lindsey Wagner and Lynda Carter, and he said, “I would only take on one other person,” and he said, “Cynthia, I would really like to manage you, but you would have to listen to me and I understand you’re still with your actor pal. Will you promise me that as soon as it’s severed for good that you’ll call me?” And I said, “Yes I will!” Then for some reason we held on for another seven or eight months. Then we separated and I never called Ron Samuels…I know, I should have. Then the time went by and I thought…Dick Zannuck isn’t at Fox anymore and the whole upper eschalon is all dissolved. Everybody’s broken away from the studios and formed their own independent companies and I don’t even know how to find anyone anymore.

SE:  Have you ever thought of doing a book on this movie?
CM:  Oh, I’ve been asked that quite a bit.

SE:  Sorry.
CM:  No, no, no… I would like to do it. And just with you and I chatting, right now I’m remembering things that I wouldn‘t normally think about in the course of a day. There were so many interesting things that were happening, but they were happening so fast that I’d say, “ I can’t believe this happened!…But I’ve got to go and read two pages of dialogue, so I’ll remember it and reminisce about it later…but right now I can’t believe it’s happening. This is like the movie’s not ending after they say cut!” So those are the cute things I’m jotting down today. So there isn’t a day that goes by now that I’m not thinking about it. I did the Hollywood Collectors Show and somebody came up to me that was in one of the party scenes at ZMan’s,  and he’s a memorabilia dealer now on Hollywood Boulevard,  and we sat and laughed for about half an hour saying, “Gosh, I forgot all about that!” So I have about 300 pages of just little things.

SE:  What was the shooting of the final party scene like?
CM:  Another cast member had taken Erica and I and someone else out to lunch and on the way back they passed around a marijuana cigarette and I said, “Oh no thank you.  We’ve got to go back to work.”  And we all took a puff off of it and when we walked in I couldn’t stop smiling. I just got that smile on my face and it wouldn’t go away. And the more you try to be straight, the more the smile is prevalent. Well, lo and behold the first scene to shoot…and Russ didn’t really even look at anybody cause he’s always looking at his watch… “C’mon you guys. Over here. This is so and so scene. O.K. you guys are all supposed to be high!” And I said, “ Great! (Laughing) This is great!” And then they played the music and I looked over at Erica and I couldn’t stop smiling. I tried to keep my lips together so that I wouldn’t laugh. So, when I see that scene…That’s a genuine…..”does anyone know I’m high?” kind of smile.  I just couldn’t wipe that smile off my face. But we’re all sitting around a hookah and I said, “Thank God this is the scene! “ Because if I had a Porter Hall scene I just couldn’t do it!

SE:  You had so many face to face scenes with other cast members, were there any times when nose to nose with someone delivering that dialogue, that you had to try to keep from laughing?
CM:  Yes, but we had to extinguish that feeling immediately because Russ is really a no nonsense kind of guy. You know, nose to the grindstone. He’d look at you and ask, “ Why are you laughing?” You just didn’t want to goof off at all.

SE: Now one thing I’ve always wondered about was that at the start of the movie you’re playing a high school dance and then you head to L.A.  But what town were you leaving from?
CM:  It wasn’t in the script. I should’ve asked Russ.

SE: Did you guys have to get familiar with your instruments before band scenes.
CM:  Stu Phillips had a bungalow at the back of Fox and he had all the instruments in there, and there was a scene that I didn’t want to have egg on my face… This scene opened with my playing the guitar, then it panned back and I had to play 6 or 7 notes and I wanted to do it accurately. So, when we weren’t shooting, we would go back to the bungalow and we would practice on our instruments. We all wanted so hard to do our best. Whenever we had free time we’d go back to the bungalow and really picked up our instruments so that we’d feel comfortable with them and be as believable as we could.  Russ took me to a concert, and I’d never been to one so I was a little intimidated being out with him at night. He took me to see the Jefferson Airplane and he’d look at me as if to say…”So you think this is beneficial for you, playing in a band? And I said, “Yes, Russ.”  (Laughs) And he always had this stern look on his face and I never knew if he was having fun or not. Then we went to watch Lynn Carey do the vocals in the studio. Her father was Macdonald Carey, the actor. And she had a group called Mama Lion and I remember on the big billboard on Sunset Boulevard it showed her nursing a lion cub and I guess even during the hippie generation people just weren’t ready for that.

SE:  Were there any other scenes other than the one I mentioned that were taken out of the movie?
CM:  There was one scene. And Russ was very excited about shooting this scene…but there was just no time to leave it in. He had a character actor who is very famous who was a friend of his. His name escapes me for the moment, but he was the perfect guy to play the gruff, paunched bellied, cigar chomping producer and this scene was in the original script and the treatment, where now we’re in Hollywood with our band and I go out for an interview and it’s a scene where he tries to get me on the casting couch. And then Russ, injecting his sense of humor…where he’s chasing me around the desk and then we end up on our hands and knees. I’m trying to get out the door and he’s tearing my clothes off. And that scene was like… seven or eight pages of dialogue. And Russ wanted the scene in so badly and that was my other big scene that didn’t get in because of the time element.

SE:  I hope if this movie comes out on DVD that they include all this footage.
CM:  I know. Oh it would be so much fun!  And everyone in the cast has such fond memories…it would be such a treat for the fans because I remember so many things from behind the scenes. I know that Edy and Erica and John Lazar have some fantastic stories. He’s just a book of information on out takes.

SE:  What was the “inside” L.A. celebrity scene like in the late 60’s early 70’s?
CM:  Gosh, you know when you see movies from that period and they’ve got the quick action and the lights and the psychedelic type thing?

SE: Yeah.
CM:  It seemed like that whole era was like that! My first Hollywood party I went to everybody would come up to me and say, “Do you want this?”  I’d say,  “What’s that?”…And I thought… I came from a place where when a man approached you, you know…in a club setting or out somewhere… he’d ask you to dance! And I’ve been sitting here for about forty-five minutes and I’ve had twenty men come up to me and offer me some kind of dope! (Laughs)  Nobody’s asked me to dance! And I thought, “Is this the way life always is? Has Hollywood always been this way?”  Everything was like “Beyond The Valley of the Dolls!” (Laughs)

SE:  I think that movie sums up the time and the place.
CM:  My gosh! Art imitates life more than expected.

SE: Now, the scene you did with Erica was pretty groundbreaking as far as mainstream movies go…
CM: I met with Russ and we did some rehearsals. Sometimes the whole cast was there and then sometimes we’d be called in for certain scenes to work it out alone with him before we actually started work at the studio. Russ said, “How do you feel?”… in other words you don’t want to hire an actor, then get the film half shot and then they get cold feet during one of the crucial scenes and say “Oh, I‘ve decided not to do that!” So this love scene with Erica, I said that I really wanted it to be believable…I don’t want it to be like, you know…ya turn on these scenes and the girl’s just moaning and she sounds so bored! Like they’re going through the motions, you know, like they’re just doing it for the camera. And I had a friend say, ”Instead of worrying so much about making it believable, why don’t you just have one?” So I just thought about it all the way home and said, “Yeah.” That day there was alot of buzz around the crew because they have to read the scripts so that they know what to set up and I saw all these extra people…You know, like all of a sudden by the coffee maker instead of three people there’d be ten. Then I said, “Oh..they’re starting to come over from other sets, the looky lous.”  So I said to Russ… and he’s great this way..anything to make the scene the best it can be… I said, “ Russ, Erica and I will be much more comfortable with a closed set. How about just you and I, the cameraman and his assistant,…a skeleton crew, you know. Maybe instead of five lighting people, just the key gaffer”… and he really knew I was very serious so it was alot more comfortable that morning when we came in because there were hardly any people there. And I said, “Perfect! He understood!” Because he would’ve done anything for us, you know, he wants this scene to be beautiful.

SE: You had to shoot that scene first thing in the morning? Right after your Cheerios?
CM: Well, I didn’t have any cheerios that morning. I had some hot tea, then I made sure Erica was comfortable because in a couple of scenes…she was having personal problems with one of the girls on the set, and the girl kept staring and intimidating her..giving her the evil eye and Erica couldn’t concentrate on the scene we were gonna do.

SE: I know that the movie didn’t get alot of press when it came out, but wasn’t it one of the biggest money makers of 1970?
CM: They took the money from it, but they didn’t treat the film the way they should have. It did make more money than “Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid”, but it was something they wanted to hide under the rug, you know? They’ll take the money from it…it’s like the way a man that has the good girl and he’s got the naughty girl on the side, and he really wants to be with the naughty girl, but he doesn’t want to be seen in public. They really didn’t want to associate their name with it or recognize it as their picture and that’s a shame. Time Magazine wrote, “Wow! This is how much money this picture has made!”, but the brass at Twentieth Century Fox were silly not to have recognized it the way that they should’ve.

SE: What was your down time like on the set? What did you do while waiting to shoot a scene?
CM: Well, what was interesting was that “Myra Breckenridge” was being shot on the same lot and “The Great White Hope”. I studied alot. I studied my role and wanted to do the best with it that I possibly could. Or Stu Phillips would show me different chords and then we’d go over to the studio where Lynne Carey was doing the vocals and we’d watch here. Alot of times Dolly and Marcia and I would go and watch Lynn Carey actually record the soundtrack and that was very interesting. So all during that time, if there was any down time, I would go over and watch her record if I didn’t have any scenes to shoot that day.

SE: Was that movie shot in the summer?
CM: It may have been the early spring.

SE: And it came out in December?
CM: Yes.

SE: Wow. So there was a big gap of time between the last day of shooting and when it hit the theatres?
CM: Uh, huh. I remember getting up at five in the morning. I remember I had a little Triumph sports car and that was chilly anyway because there were so many air holes. I would put a blanket over my legs because it was really cold in the morning.

SE: Now today, they would’ve taken the Carrie-Nations’ image and ran it into the ground with records, comic books, a TV series, a Saturday morning cartoon, action figures….Was there ever any talk of merchandising? Or a sequel?
CM: That’s something that at this upcoming reunion…like a BVO tribute that I hope Russ and Roger Ebert are able to attend and I can ask them today. It was such a strange time because Dick Zannuck, the head of  the studio, was just leaving because of conflicts and creative differences and that’s when all the big oil companies started buying up all the movie studios…and that probably would’ve happened, but Dick Zannuck got together with Helen Gurley Brown’s husband David Brown and just said, “The heck with it. I’m going to go and make films. There’s too many people to fight with here. Nothing getting done!” So they formed their own company and their first picture was “Jaws”. And that’s not a bad first little picture! But with the studio falling apart, and with the new regime..or no regime… let’s put it that way…they just took the money from “Doll’s” and just sort of forgot about it.

SE: That’s too bad.
CM: It is.

SE:  So were there any scenes that you kind of felt uncomfortable with or didn’t really want to do?
CM: No, I was pretty much comfortable with everything once I decided not to worry about that major love scene any more. I was just pleased to be able to go to work every day and do the best that I could. Most of the scenes were between Erica and I or us and the band. So what was going on with the other characters…They were on the set a different day than I was. So I really didn’t know what was happening with Zman’s character and Jungle Boy. (laughs)

SE: Were there any other scenes other than getting high at Zman’s party that were alot of fun for you?
CM: Oh, the music was fun! Alot of fun. Who doesn’t want to be a rock and roll star? Even if you’re just faking it real good.  I mean…You had your audience right there and they had to clap whether you were good or not cause it was in the scene. But oh, that was fun to be a rock star and be glamoured up. Just a real kick, like a fantasy.

SE: Did you have to ever do more that one take of the band scenes?
CM: When we came in we were all pretty much prepared. I think the only time we’d have to redo it was if the sound wasn’t right, which wasn’t our fault, but then they could always go over that when they were editing.

SE: So, one camera for each of you?
CM: I think they were shooting with three different cameras. Then you have Russ doing what he does best which is editing.

SE: Who’s home did they use for the outside shots?
CM: That was up in Suma Beach which is part of Malibu. The party scenes where we sang and Jungle Boy got his head cut off… that was a set. But the scenes in the house where we were getting murdered..that was a real house.

SE: Yeah. Whose house was that?
CM: You know, I don’t know. I’m going to have to ask Russ about that.

SE: So, what did your mom say when you brought her to see the movie?
CM: Well, I didn’t  take her to see it because it showed in my home town. It previewed there and I was at another premiere and was already committed to going to this one….and because that was my home town they brought out those great big lights that they use at openings….Toledo’s Cynthia Myers!…and all my teachers went and my grandfather went…and my mother said, “ Oh, honey I felt so bad when you got killed.” That’s what she said. Everybody was real proud of me, but nobody mentioned the love scene.

SE: Wow, maybe they cut it out.
CM: (laughs) No, no. I don’t think they could..(laughing)..but I was just wondering what some of my teachers thought…

SE: I always said she was a wild one!
CM: Yeah! (laughing) I said…”Oh, I’m gonna go to Hollywood..” They said, “Sure. Until you leave for Hollywood get in there and do your homework!”

SE: You see what happens when you go to that Sin Town?
CM: Oh, yes…(laughing) “You’re not going to start smoking pot out there are you?”…things like that. I said, “No Mom, I promise.”  (laughs) And then it didn’t help that in Benedict Canyon where I was living…the house down below me…like if I went to the edge of my property and looked down?…That’s where Sharon Tate got murdered. So that didn’t really help alot. I remember saying,  “There’s something wrong.” And a friend said, “You know how the dogs are in the canyon. One dog saw a rabbit,  then they all started barking and it just echoed through the canyon.” And I said, “No, they’ve never barked like that before! There’s something weird happening!” …and that was the night they were getting murdered.

SE: Wow. Wasn’t that movie accused…in the press at least..of cashing in on the Manson killings?
CM: Yes. And Russ said, “Oh what the heck”…having the exploitive nature he has..He said, “Oh so what. I’ve never been known for being one with the most taste.” Or politically correct…Russ is so cute.  It’s like he’s making a big pot of soup and he just wants to throw all kinds of stuff in there.

SE: If that sort of thing happened today it would just triple the income and create so much curiosity about the film.
CM: Absolutely!

SE: Has there ever been a time when folks didn’t come up to you and go on about this movie?
CM: Now that I’m doing more shows I’ve been getting some true fans and just as many women as men. But just as many people love the music and the bizarreness of it.

SE: And the fashion.
CM: Yes! And with Mike Meyers doing takeoffs in his Austin Powers film…he sort of did that party scene in that first film..It was identical to Zman’s party! And I didn’t realize it until someone showed it to me.

SE: There’s never been a lull in people talking about that movie to you? It’s been continuous?
CM: There’s always been such a loyal cult…people started showing me these cult film magazines and I had no idea that people would have websites and chat rooms talking about the film. Then someone had sent me a program from a play. It was a female impersonator show and they were using lines out of the film and I thought, “Holy Cow!”

SE: How was it doing scenes with John Lazar?
CM: Oh, he was so wonderful. He was into that so seriously! Even when he was doing the Shakespeare lines…on the internet there’s some of the most memorable lines like, “ You will drink the black sperm of my vengeance!” And I’d think, “Oh, my. That was in there!  How weird!”

SE: Did you ever look at him during a scene and think, “Wow, this guy just is an amazing actor!…or is this guy just tweaked?”
CM: Uh, I did think that because he kept to himself ..and I did too…but I thought, ” Wow!” And I think that we all did after those meetings with Russ in his townhouse… I think that when we all walked out of there we were all in it for the long haul! We were gonna go in there and make it believable – even in the comic situations and do the best we could and then let Russ edit it. And Stu Phillips was wonderful with the music. So it was a combination of everybody… “Each of us are going to give 150% and then what you do with it after that…..”

SE: What was one of your favorite lines in the film?
CM: The abortion scene…there’s a funny line.. After all of the narcotics that Roxanne and Zman have tried to supply me with and then I didn’t realize at the time how funny this was….Before Roxanne and I go in she’s got my hand and she’s taking me in for the abortion and I say, “Roxanne, can I please have just one of my dolls?” And she says, “Not now, it could be dangerous”! (laughs) Of all the times when you need something! She should’ve handed me a whole bottle and said, “We’ll go for martinis afterwards”.

SE: The way that scene was edited made it really funny!
CM: I know.

SE: Especially when it goes to that doctor with those 3 inch thick glasses.
CM: Oh I know. That’s Russ’s humor… unmistakeably Russ Meyer casting there.

SE: While you were on the Playboy After Dark series, was that a good way to network and meet alot of people in the biz?
CM: Well, it’s funny. I would meet these girls who would eat, sleep, and breath doing interviews and “Who am I going to meet?” and “Can I please come to this party? I’ve heard so and so will be there.” I was never into that. It was just all so… I just figured I’d just study…Playboy asked me to do the TV show. I didn’t ask to do it and Russ Meyer asked me to screen test. I didn’t pursue things as actively as some of these girls. Bette Davis said, “You’ve got to want this more than anything else in the world! More than a relationship! More than a husband! More than children! More than life itself!” and I thought, “That’s a little overboard.” Yet I always had the question…when is this gonna happen?! But on the other hand, I knew that if I was gonna stay home no one was going to come and knock on my door either. So people would coax me to come out and say, ”You should meet this person.” And I’d say, “I know what it’s gonna be. I’ll meet this person and they’re always gonna have a script whether it’s something that’s lying around under their bed or something that’s been in their garage. And they’re going to ask me to come over and read it and it’s going to be the same scenario. They’re gonna, you know, show me their house and they always end up showing me the bedroom and that’s where they ask me to sit down. And I say, “Yes. It’s a nice home” and by the time I look around and come back they’re trying to push me down on the bed! So I’d just say, “No thank you.” I’m so tired of those…and you’re sincere and you get up and you get your portfolio together and you put on your best little suit and your best little pumps, and fix your hair perfect, and they’re just…

SE: Gonna take you to the casting mattress.
CM: Yes. You just feel like saying…”Before I get all ready and you want me there by nine..because that’s when the studio’s gonna be dark and there’s gonna be just a few people around…and you just so happen to have somebody’s bungalow to use…Are you really calling me out because you want me to read or are you calling me out because you want to have sex? Please let me know now because I could never do that!” I could never say that then. And it doesn’t just happen to actresses. I’ve got a writer lady friend of mine and we’d be over by her pool and she’d say, “I’ve gotta go for cocktails and then we’re gonna go to a screening.” And then she’d get all ready like she was an actress and she’d say, “Well, I’ve got to play the game too.” They would try and get her in bed too! And here you should be able to go by….

SE: Your merits.
CM: Absolutely. It’s such an insult. It’s such a cruel thing to do to somebody. First of all, I would never want to be with anybody that didn’t feel the same way about me, but these people don’t care! I mean, you could look at them and say,” I find you obnoxious!” And they’d say,” That’s okay, lay down.”

SE: (laughs)
CM: (laughs) “Try not to look at me ..just lie down!” When I look back on that and all the times I thought, “This is great and I respect his work.” Alot of times I’d go and get the paperback of the movie and I’d stay up all night before and I’d read a little of the book. I mean, just to prepare so that if they were to say something I could intelligently say something from the novel. And here they are, they’re not even thinking about me until I get there and they look at me and say, “Oh yeah, that’s the one with the nice body. I’m going to help you today.” And off to so and so’s bungalow. It’s terrible.

SE: And it still must go on today. I know that I sometimes see a movie and think, “Someone must have really gotten did to get this into production!”
CM: The only thing that is more prevalent today is that the men are…I mean, I’m sure there has always been the Harry Weiss’s that waited for every cute young man to come to town. He had Rock Hudson, Troy Donahue, Tab Hunter…Harry Weiss was one and the other was Henry Wilson. He made no bones about it. “I really like you and if I’m just going to sleep with you perhaps I’ll just give you some money on the side or I’ll give you a part time job as my chauffeur. But if I really go to bat for you because I’m really gonna try and make you a star and change your name and everything, you’re still going to sleep with me!”

SE: L.A. huh?
CM: It just all built up and I had a whole flashback of those days when my little car that didn’t have any air conditioning and I’m so excited and I’m trying to think..”Can I get a drive on pass or am I gonna have to walk five blocks?” You know, it’s just the whole thing of getting there and it’s such a terrible let down.

SE: This might be why “Beyond The Valley of the Dolls” wasn’t a huge commercial, mainstream hit. Because it struck too many a nerve and hit home to alot of Hollywood heavy hitters. It was too true to life.
CM: It’s like looking in the mirror and you know what you’re seeing is really there, but you’d rather not look.

SE: Now in the late 60’s you were a bunny at the Chicago club? Was it as tough as they portray it in all those made for TV movies?
CM: One thing I remember is when you got to be a Barracuda Bunny and you’d better not get in their way! Because these girls were taking two to five thousand dollars a night out of there. They’d have so much money in their bunny costumes when they went to the rest room they had to go to their lockers and unload it into bags and then go back out on the floor. That was a hard earned rank! When you’re carrying a tray with people just flinging their arms around…and like being conventioneers and drunk and you’re in stiletto high heels with this terribly uncomfortable costume on…and you’re carrying a tray on your right arm and it’s weighing between sixty and sixty five pounds with food and drinks and everything had to be poured in order…..Now that is hard work!

SE: Oh, yeah.
CM: And the harder you worked the more money you brought home each night. And there was one Bunny, I can’t remember her name, but she started buying real estate in Chicago.

SE: Smart!
CM: Yes, I guess she started when the clubs first opened and she owns a good portion of downtown Chicago.

SE: Wow! Were you ever photographed by Bunny Yeagar?
CM: She was supposed to photograph me when I was down in Florida on that semester break and my mother called me and said, “Playboy wants you to fly there.” That’s when I was coming out of the swimming pool and the photographer said, “Do you mind if I take your picture?” and I said, “I don’t mind.” Then the next day I was on the front page of the Miami Reporter. And he said to me, “There’s a lady down here that is a Glamour photographer named Bunny Yeagar” and he gave me her number and I almost called her, but my mother said that Playboy wants you to get on a plane tomorrow and get to Chicago right away…

SE: Your probably the best known playmate!
CM: When I came in as the #10 Playmate of the Century I was so shocked…I was kind of overwhelmed for a moment and I thought..(laughing)..somebody likes me! You know, like…I wasn’t one of Hef’s babes, you know. Was it that Pompeo Posar’s photographs were that astounding? Or because of the Vietnam war? Or… I don’t know. And not one of my so called playmate friends acknowledged or called me up to congratulate me or even to call and say, “You bitch! How did you get so high?” You know, kiddingly. Nobody said anything! I see some of the girls saying, “I’m in the top 50” or “I came in the top 20” or “I’m one of the girls of the century list.” And my goodness!…That’s a title most girls would give their eye teeth for and my goodness..it’s a title that you deserved and nobody can take it away from you, so if you’re Playboy’s #10… and it’s cute to be 10 because of the expression “she’s a ten.”

SE: Right.
CM: So my sister says, “Who cares about the other girls. Half of them are just jealous anyway.”

SE: There wasn’t really any star or co-star in “Beyond The Valley of the Dolls”. Everyone pretty much had equal billing right?
CM:  A funny thing…I was over at a friend’s house for dinner one night and his wife told me,  “You know you’re in the Guiness Book of World Records?” And we all started looking at each other. I started laughing and I said, “My God. What did I do? I’m in The Guiness Book of World Records?” And under 1970 it says, “Beyond The Valley of the Dolls” one of the worst films ever made! (laughs) And it had two names listed because they couldn’t get a list of everybody and it had I believe John Lazar and myself. But it’s okay, you know, if your name’s in The Guiness Book….It’s something that I don’t go around saying, but…

SE: Well, being called the worst movie today is sort of a badge of honor.
CM:  Exactly! I just thought that was kind of funny. But Dolly was the main character since she was the lead singer and she didn’t get killed off and she sort of like went through the whole picture.

SE: You know, the other day my kids were watching some show on Nickelodeon and I noticed one of the characters was played by the guy that played Baxter Wolf in “Dolls”.
CM:  Oh, Charles Napier! He did “Harry, Cherry and Raquel”. He did “Vixen”. And that’s when Russ was shooting pictures and it was such a shoestring budget and such a skeleton crew that he told stories of being in the back of the pickup and they were going to another location and he had the men actors carrying cameras and the cables. Everybody was out there trying to help get this film made.

SE: During one scene when the band does a TV show..and the host has these orange glasses on?
CM: Oh God, yes I remember.

SE: And Dolly Reed tries to cover her accent while asking you if you’d like to play “Find It” and you seem like you’re laughing…Do you remember what it was you were laughing about?
CM:  I was trying not to laugh at her accent. (laughing) Besides that, everywhere I looked something was funny…the guy with the glasses and I think he had a flowered shirt on. It was just one of those mid mornings and I was just in a funny mood, and I just said, “Yeah, I can handle it” because there were so many scenes that were…Like I was too much the femme fatale and I just thought, “Let my character smile a little bit”, you know. But I know why I laughed. It wasn’t written and Dolly winged it  and said, “But seriously though folks” and it reminded me of a cartoon. And I just started laughing. And I’d look at the guy and he would try to be so serious at being the talk show host. He only worked one day on the film and was trying to be so good.

SE: That scene was very funny.
CM:  There were certain scenes that I just cracked up.

SE: Have there been any roles that you’ve turned down? That were maybe way over the top for you?
CM:  (sigh) Oh, yes. There’s been alot of just very exploitive lovemaking scenes and things like that.

SE: And during the 80’s you did some TV?
CM:  I did a Bob Hope special where I danced. It was a Bob Hope/Ann Margaret special and I danced on that and did a little skit with Bob Hope.

SE: Then in the mid eighties you settled down, got married, had kids.
CM:  Right. I was just here in the desert. I was raising my son and I had my horse and I was just busy with being a homemaker. And I called Playboy just to let them know where I was just in case somebody would say you know…the screen actors guild or whatever…for the record this is my address. And they called me right back and said, “Hef wants you to come to the Mansion.” There had been certain times when he would want me to come over and say, “There’s so many people that I want you to meet.” And I just didn’t feel like going in there and saying, “Ooh, I’m a Playgirl! Here I am! I’m available!” and then alot of guys get the wrong ideas about going to the Mansion. They think,” Oh Gee, I’ll take that redhead and …”  That’s your order. You’re in Baskin Robbins like you’re ordering ice cream cones! And some of these girls, all you’ve got to do is say, “Hey babe!” And they’re all available you know. Some are, some aren’t. I never was! And then Hef asked me to the party for the first coffee table book and he selected seven or eight girls and I was one of them. And he came over and sat next to me and said, “Why didn’t you ever call?” or “Why didn’t you ever come over?” And I said to Hef, “ You know me. I’m just too shy. And alot of the men who come here and they’re looking for a playmate kind of girl for the night, and I’m just not that kind of girl. I’m just too shy.” So if I meet someone there and it starts getting late like eleven o’clock and I’d say, “If you think you’re going home with me, I’d better tell you right now, you’re not!”

SE: (laughing)
CM: (laughs)…. “So there’s still time and alot of beautiful women around. You’d better go find somebody cause I’m not the one you’re going home with tonight.” So that’s kind of what would be going through my mind. So it’s kind of silly for me to go there. I’m just not a one night stand type…I’m sure relationships do blossom out of initial reactions and an exchange of phone numbers and things like that, but under the Playboy type atmosphere it’s sort of like, “Oh gosh! Free love!” and I’ve just never been one of those free love type of girls. And then the girls would kind of joke about…like, “I’ve had him.” Someone said that to me recently and I looked at her and I thought, “Well, that’s very liberating! Usually a guy says that.” And I’ve never wanted a man to be able to say that about me, “Oh, I’ve had her.”

SE: Another notch in the bedpost.
CM:  Right. Any man that I choose to be intimate with would never say anything like that. I certainly hope. I hope I had good character judgment. And she was just being so…like “oh, I had him” and in a way I said, “Well good for you that you could talk like that.” Because for so many years guys would say “Yeah, I had her last night, yeah.” And now here alot of women are saying it and it just kind of shocked me.

SE: Well, I’m sure that there are alot of actors that wish that they had one movie on their resumes that thirty years later folks are still buying on video and thinking that it’s a great movie.
CM:  I am so pleased that you are fond of the film.

SE: It’s brilliant.
CM:  Because it certainly is bizarre and is the type of thing that when you see it you don’t easily forget it. Because you just say, “Oh my gosh! What the heck did I just see?” And it’s all fun and when you think you’ve got something figured out….The brilliance of Russ..he throws something else into the pot of soup and you say, “Whoa, where did that come from?” And it’s just sort of a feast for the ears and the eyes and the imagination. And it’s so nice when I read that it’s Russ Meyer’s masterpiece. And that makes me feel good for him because he worked so hard and was under so much pressure…because here he was with the big boys now. Like he was under a microscope. “Let’s see what the porno guy..or the guy that started in the film business by carrying three cans of film in the trunk of his car through the Midwest trying to find theatres that would show his movies without having the Justice of the Peace coming and arresting him.”

SE: Yeah, I guess at that time all he was known for was…
CM:  The nudie cuties!

SE: Yeah. High budget stag films.
CM:  Uh huh.

SE: Oh, before I forget…on Laugh-In during the party scenes they used alot of Playmates and dancers. Did you ever do that show?
CM:  No, I didn’t. I do remember that there were some girls that went from the Playboy After Dark show right over to…The Dean Martin show.

SE: If “Beyond The Valley of the Dolls” ever does come out on DVD, I do hope that they include any scenes with you and John Lazar that might’ve been left on the cutting room floor originally.
CM:  My big main scene was cut out only because Edy started sleeping with Russ. And right in the middle of the picture Edy had more dialogue written in and my scene was cut. But I’m not bitter about it. We were really looking forward to that scene. The only other thing I can think of as to why it had been cut is that the film was too long or because Edy was getting more play in the Rolls Royce scene. Who knows?

SE: That was a great scene.
CM:  She was good in that. And what’s scary is that everybody turned out to be their character. I hope John Lazar isn’t. (laughs) But I am the shy one and Edy is the perpetual starlet, as always. And Jungle Boy is still trying to be Jungle Boy…

SE: They do add lost scenes to alot of movies that are re-recorded on DVD today.
CM: That’s a wonderful idea. It’s like the icing on the cake for the fans.